VVV and Washburn

doublev · Post by **doublev** » Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:24 am

You would think Jackson would have owned the vv shape seen as they designed it and I thought if you can prove you were the first to make it you can still make with or without a copyright.

poserboy71 · Post by **poserboy71** » Thu Dec 30, 2010 10:45 am

Genebaby wrote:The main reason they use to not make a guitar/shape these days is owner copyright. This is due to Fender, who are so lame they won't even do a guitar like Jake E Lee's white guitar. It's actually a Fender that Charvel worded on but you can't order a white Charvel to the same specs. It's just a white Strat!!!! Same goes for the blue one, you can't get that pickup combo, colour and bridge.

I think they would now . Fender owns Jackson.

Post by **Genebaby** » Thu Dec 30, 2010 4:13 pm

No Dino, that's the problem, Fender is such a big PC corporation they have tightened the rules on what's allowed, and things that are too close to a well known artist guitar are out. Which is crazy when some artists just play an otherwise regular guitar that they happen to like.

shramiac · Post by **shramiac** » Thu Dec 30, 2010 5:34 pm

Genebaby wrote:The main reason they use to not make a guitar/shape these days is owner copyright. This is due to Fender, who are so lame they won't even do a guitar like Jake E Lee's white guitar. It's actually a Fender that Charvel worded on but you can't order a white Charvel to the same specs. It's just a white Strat!!!! Same goes for the blue one, you can't get that pickup combo, colour and bridge.

Weren't they 24 3/4 scale length guitars? And did Fender own Charvel as early as 85'?

Post by **Genebaby** » Thu Dec 30, 2010 6:05 pm

It's not the scale length, it's the design. Fender are over careful about upsetting anyone except their customers.

Charvel was still owned by Grover in '85. He sold out to Akai, who sold it to Fender about 5 years ago now. Has it been that long?

DarrenD · Post by **DarrenD** » Fri Dec 31, 2010 9:34 pm

Yep, Fender picked up Jackson and Charvel around 5-6 years ago - as well as Hamer. I believe they were all 24.75, correct?

Are there any more photos of the Ibanez and Washburn VV guitar other than those photoshoots?

doublev · Post by **doublev** » Sat Jan 01, 2011 2:38 am

Only seen 3 pictures of the washburn and only seen the ibanez in the love kills video with no pictures

Post by **Streetbeat** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:55 am

Where is that Washburn an Ibanez now ?

Post by **Genebaby** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 8:05 am

They are Missing In Action.

doublev · Post by **doublev** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 8:52 am

maybe TM One knows!!! I am sure he has them.. no vv guitar vinnie has owned has ever surfaced anywhere as well as that strange looking ESP.

poserboy71 · Post by **poserboy71** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:32 am

We discussed this before and have guessed the hows and whys of Vinnie not admitting that he still owns these guitars. Kiss would probably try and confiscate them for monies owed... If anything ,Vinnie may have sold a lot of the vintage instruments he had.

shramiac · Post by **shramiac** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 10:29 am

doublev wrote: as well as that strange looking ESP.

Please, please don't mention that thing again! My stomach just couldn't handle it!!!

BARF!

doublev · Post by **doublev** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 12:25 am

i like the ESP, its a testament to the 80s. I wish VV would just give us one interview based on all his old guitars. I bet the ESP sounds good even though it may look to have some playability issues with access to frets. Its the only guitar I have seen with VV's name on it too.
I think someone here could arrange for some guitar collector magazine to interview vv about all those guitars.. what a great time to do that with the new version coming out. Maybe, maybe, he may include the history of his guitar in the new collectable catalog.. that would really send that material over the top. Like I say, this is the best time to do something like that.
Please VV, consider it. It would pay off big time!!

shramiac · Post by **shramiac** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 10:24 am

Maybe you or Vinnie could try asking the ESP forums Dino? Can't see what possibly could go wrong there!!!??

poserboy71 · Post by **poserboy71** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 2:23 pm

Dino, You and I spoke before about getting Vinnie an interview with Guitar Player Magazine.
Do you want to pursue this or wait to see if Vinnie starts to be cool with us ?

doublev · Post by **doublev** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 5:41 pm

Real helpful guys and soooo knowledgeable. Salt of the earth! Those esp guys are so eager to help.. lol

DarrenD · Post by **DarrenD** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:58 pm

Hi everybody - Shramiac pointed out on the Washburn forums that the guitar was indeed seen on the "That Time of Year" video. I've been going through some VV videos and I totally didn't see it until now. I always get so confused because he switches back and forth between the Carvin and Jackson so much! Thanks to the eagle eyes on this forum. I would have never found it.

And now looking closely, I do see the heel-less side. I haven't heard back from Stephen Davies regarding the guitar, but it looks like the guitar may of had a neck-thru version of the SEC....it's really tough to tell from the video alone how it was done. The only other neck-thru models that had the SEC were the EC29 and 36, both of which I owned - and they simply are the smoothest and sleekish heel-less design I have ever played. Ironically, the EC29 and 36 were designed right around mid-late '87 as well. I really wish there were more pics of this guitar. I'll definitely let you guys know if I hear anymore regarding it.

[youtube][/youtube]

shramiac · Post by **shramiac** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 2:49 pm

Thanks for that better quality youtube link Darren. That definately is a heel-less guitar! Dino always said he thought the Washburn had the best fret access! Now we know his suspicion was correct!

doublev · Post by **doublev** » Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:27 pm

The washburn seems to be the most dynamic, best finished and most perfected of all the vv models.

Lil' Jack Horny · Post by **Lil' Jack Horny** » Sun Jan 16, 2011 10:14 am

You're wrong, jsullysix on Youtube has a white Charvel Jake E Lee that he claims was made for him by custom shop. Check it out.

There are other clips on his page of him playing the very guitar. I always liked Jakes Charvel strats as I've always been a big Jake E Lee fan. It's never too late to cry.

Post by **Genebaby** » Sun Jan 16, 2011 2:33 pm

Hi Jack, I know Sully, we go way back. The guitar would have been built prior to Fender owning the company, or even at the very beginning.

Charvel have made a lot of guitars they would never build again for the general public.

doublev · Post by **doublev** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:32 am

by the way I have to say teej and freddy were the guys who pointed out the washburn had good fret access.. i just copied what they say because I don't have the eyes that most people have on this board.

DarrenD · Post by **DarrenD** » Wed Jan 26, 2011 5:11 pm

Got a hold a Steve for a short bit and in communication regarding the guitar. He can't remember the details off the top of his head, but he does remember dropping the guitar off to Vinnie during one of his gigs in Seattle. He recalls hand-drawn blueprints stashed away somewhere and will take pictures if he finds it. That's literally all I have right now, but I will keep everyone updated if something else pop up.

Post by **Genebaby** » Wed Jan 26, 2011 6:17 pm

Blueprints!!! We want to see those!!!!! Thanks Darren!!

poserboy71 · Post by **poserboy71** » Wed Jan 26, 2011 10:11 pm

Yep, Vinnie's gonna love us now. Be careful that this doesn't make you a target as well Darren. Great work.

DarrenD · Post by **DarrenD** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 5:24 am

I wouldn't hold my breath guys because he wasn't 100% sure if he had them or not.....nor if they are in good condition or how much of a "rough" draft they are. They definitely won't be computer enhanced styles....literally hand drawn. He has a storage unit that load of his former SSI materials laying around and it could be a mess.

I want to see more damn pictures of this guitar. I can't believe there are only two pictures on the entire net of it.

poserboy71 · Post by **poserboy71** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 5:36 am

We would gladly have paid Vinnie if he had fair pricing but this shit is an insult. I'm spending my cash with TJ MONSTER Guitars.I only accept GREAT product at GREAT prices from GREAT people.

TJ MONSTER Guitars fit my criteria while exceeding my expectations.

doublev · Post by **doublev** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:11 am

that would mean that VV got his washburn on August 5 1988in Seattle, WA (according to kissfaq this gig was taped). that doesn't make sense because the 'that time of year' video came out in July 1988.

doublev · Post by **doublev** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:14 am

i am not questioning anything here but the dates don't add up.

poserboy71 · Post by **poserboy71** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 10:46 am

Maybe Vinnie had it in the video, GAVE IT BACK FOR SOME TWEAKING, then received it again in August.

DarrenD · Post by **DarrenD** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 10:50 am

Yeah I don't know. He said it was at a small club just north of Seattle. Any Seattle dates in '87?

poserboy71 · Post by **poserboy71** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 11:06 am

I hope those blueprints exist and we can see them. I am holding my breath.

DarrenD · Post by **DarrenD** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 11:17 am

I'm guessing he has a lot of his old documents, pictures, etc. laying around in his storage. This was 23 years ago and he probably didn't really go through all of his storage until 1997 when SSI went under.....14 years ago. I wouldn't expect any updates on this situation for at least another month or so.

poserboy71 · Post by **poserboy71** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 11:28 am

We are used to waiting at the VVFF.

shramiac · Post by **shramiac** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 1:27 pm

poserboy71 wrote:We are used to waiting at the VVFF.

That would be cool to see some real info on the guitars though, rather than the dribble we sprout!!!

doublev · Post by **doublev** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 6:41 pm

Aug 5 1988 is the only Seattle date vv has ever played. He did spokane in Feb 87 but that was opening for iron maiden.
I believe the love kills video could have been made just after Seattle . But that time of year aired in mid July when vv and mark slaughter hosted the headbangers ball. Vv himself calls the white and gold combo as the 88 also.

teej · Post by **teej** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 1:14 pm

cant compare the Jackson to anything as there are none out there .. but they really did build a hell of a vvv .. I cant blame them for not doing many .. and as for the stevens cutaway .. it's really not necessary .. upper acces is secondary to none even with a standard heel

poserboy71 · Post by **poserboy71** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 1:37 pm

I was thinking the same thing because it is neck through construction and also a "V". The shape of the recess at the neck joint is similar to the Stevens cutaway . Ace Frehley had a similar cutaway on his Les Paul standard in the mid seventies.

Shred4hire · Post by **Shred4hire** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 2:46 pm

ok rick you rawk!!

shramiac · Post by **shramiac** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:28 pm

Brooklyn just started asking about the Wasburn so I directed him to this thread so I watched the video again. At the 3.09 mark, what is that sticking out behind the low E stringclamp bolt??? Is it a D tuner????? Did Vinnie have one 7 or 8 years before Eddie??? Did he invent it? Am I just seeing things and clutching at straws???
The guitar may be the Carvin though, looks like the block inlays behind the chickybabe!

Post by **Genebaby** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:24 pm

Bloody hell you were looking closely weren't you? That does look like a D-tuna. When did Eddie commercially release the D-tuna?

Brooklyn_Born · Post by **Brooklyn_Born** » Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:32 pm

Attention to detail Shram! Awesome!

quentin · Post by **quentin** » Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:28 pm

Ed I believe came out with the D tuna possibly after hagar left, and Gary Cherone came in. I believe it was on his peavy wolfgang.

Post by **Genebaby** » Fri Apr 01, 2011 5:29 pm

Yes, and the Wolfgang is a mid 90's guitar at least.

shramiac · Post by **shramiac** » Fri Apr 01, 2011 7:49 pm

Keep your pants on guys & gals! Looks like it's just a shadow in the Floyd recess! At the end of the clip you can see how deep the recess is and the fact that in all the other shots of the guitar, there's no "D tuner"! Sorry for the false alarm! Got us going there for a bit though!!!!!!

Post by **Genebaby** » Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:51 pm

Cool, it was strange that Vinnie would be using one, let alone have one before release. Years before release.

shramiac · Post by **shramiac** » Sat Apr 02, 2011 10:03 am

I swear it wasn't an April Fools joke either!!!!

metatron · Post by **metatron** » Sun Apr 03, 2011 12:18 am

shramiac wrote:I swear it wasn't an April Fools joke either!!!!

Fuck me you got great eye sight.

poserboy71 · Post by **poserboy71** » Sun Apr 03, 2011 12:44 am

Maybe it was an extra bar (along the lines of the small palm bar on Kahlers) that Vinnie added to the Floyd ???

shramiac · Post by **shramiac** » Sun Apr 03, 2011 1:53 am

Nah! Definately the recess. The size of the recess points to the guitar being delivered to Vinnie with a standard Floyd which he then swapped for his preferred non-fine tuning model.