VV' s musical and technical studies and talk

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tukoztukoz
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VV' s musical and technical studies and talk

Postby tukoztukoz » Sun Sep 10, 2017 6:07 pm

I think a section about VV' s musical and technical stuff is missing on VVFF. There are many posts here and there that talk about it, but they are unfortunately lost and forgotten.
Among the comments we can read on the net and youtube about VV ' s music(best example : REH vid), a few are interesting, all the rest is written by boring haters. It would be great to reunite all that' s interesting about all those analyses
Again, I ´m thinking about VV' s music only, nothing about VV's life.
What do you think about that?
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shramiac
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Re: VV' s musical and technical studies and talk

Postby shramiac » Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:52 pm

Cool.

I'll start...he was scary fast and had a brilliant sense of melody. Would love to hear more of his acoustic work. "Ya Know I'm Pretty Shot" still blows my mind!
Purple guitars kick ass!

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tukoztukoz
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Re: VV' s musical and technical studies and talk

Postby tukoztukoz » Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:32 pm

I like what Possio wrote in the metal tech thread :


by Possio » Sat May 21, 2011 2:10 am

I love it for the weirdness of it all.
The basic idea seems to be: as long as the harmonic structure is really static, like
( E5 and/or D5 and no 3ds etc etc..) you can color with whatever notes, harmonic structure
you like and let the lead be the color of the chord, as opposed to the other way around.
/O

Postby Possio » Sat May 21, 2011 6:23 pm

Good points there too shramiac. Sure, Vinnie knows his "shit" just like so many
other (rock)fusion players do. It´s just really hard to pull those chord voices thru
with massive distortion and stuff.....It just turns to mush. Then if you do play clean
and let the chords ring clean, it´s no longer Hard Rock, it turns into something else...
So, my idea is that he did an interesting concept with it and still maintained the rock/metal sound.
Check out Shawn Lane for more of this, althoug, his music is very very far from Rocking in my opinion.
Vinnies stuff is cool! Thanks Vinnie!
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poserboy71
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Re: VV' s musical and technical studies and talk

Postby poserboy71 » Sat Sep 16, 2017 12:05 am

Pulse.
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tukoztukoz
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Re: VV' s musical and technical studies and talk

Postby tukoztukoz » Sat Sep 16, 2017 12:20 am

That was a good one (already shown somewhere but worth the rereading): https://www.guitar-muse.com/guitar-note ... ncent-5165
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Hummarstra
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Re: VV' s musical and technical studies and talk

Postby Hummarstra » Sat Sep 23, 2017 5:29 am

This is an interesting thread. Thanks for starting it. I'm a musician and I frankly don't give two shits about his personal life. I'm only interested in HOW he did it. Vinnie as musician to me is filled with contradictions. Ironically, it's his shredding that I usually don't care for (and I'm a fan of the great shredders.) I understand that on the VVI albums Dana punched in his solos and strung together the solos we hear on the albums. So, instead of writing a solo with a beginning, middle and an end you get kind of a patch work of licks, like sewing together a quilt. I'm not a fan of this approach. I think one of the moments that really leaps out on the ASG album is the beginning of the Ashes to Ashes solo where V plays the Jeff Beck stlye licks for about 5-6 measures. Just magical. And then goes into a harmonic minor shred (although I think he's just playing minor.) And, then there are the volume swell/delay lines. But, it ends up being unrelated patterns -- again -- sewn together like a quilt. So, I'm really torn on his soloing style. I didn't become a fan of V until I heard his singing and the songs he'd written. His shredding, to me, is weird branch off the musical tree that is Vinnie.

I have no idea where I'm going with this lol.

tukoztukoz, am I way off base here? Did I take this thread somewhere it shouldn't go?

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tukoztukoz
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Re: VV' s musical and technical studies and talk

Postby tukoztukoz » Sat Sep 23, 2017 5:49 am

No, you brought interesting points here. Punch ins sound very different from his 10 min. live solos, beginning and end of Reh vid, or speedball jam. Kind of impossible to play naturally ( see the Reh vid where he does playback on recorded ASG solos)
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Re: VV' s musical and technical studies and talk

Postby Cernex » Tue Nov 28, 2017 9:52 pm

I'm no musician so all I can say is that MAN I love his crazy shredding, and that's all that matters to me, really. I know there's a technique behind it, but I'll let the experts handle that, then I'll read that and pretend I understand, :D
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tukoztukoz
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Re: VV' s musical and technical studies and talk

Postby tukoztukoz » Sat Dec 16, 2017 6:35 am

Here's something interesting written recently by Luigi Patiil on REH video comments :

"people don't understand this style, mainly because of their musical ignorance, especially music theory.....what this really is, is jazz guitar played very fast with distortion. Think more Shawn Lane than Paul Gilbert. Vinnie doesn't use common formulas like straight pentatonics, etc...and he makes it very clear at the start of the video. It's all licks played on extended or altered chords, he fused jazz guitar with shred and metal guitar, which is why it sounds weird to people who don't listen to jazz. You might not like his style, but the guy is master of the fretboard. Not everybody follows the beaten path. If you hear someone like the composer Arnold Schoenberg, you probably won't like it. But just because you don't like it and don't understand it, can't say that it's trash. These things are acquired tastes. The only weak point I see in Vinnie's otherwise excellent mastery of the fretboard, is his obsession with speed. He's hardly the only one with that obsession..... 98 per cent of all guitarists have the same problem.

The other problem is that, at the time, every ignorant and idiotic 'critic' was saying of anybody who played metal guitar fast, that they all ripped off Malmsteen, which is obviously false.....Malmsteen didn't invent anything, what he did was taking what was already there, and putting it in a heavy metal contest....if you hear the album 'Tour de Force' by Al Di Meola, you'll see very easily what I mean, as Di Meola was doing it before everyone else. The album was released in 1982, and he had been shredding for years before, so you can safely bet your guitar on the fact that it was really Di Meola who, without intention, started the 'shred guitar' style. Because of the stupid critics who then said that every other shred player copied Malmsteen, players like Vincent who still wanted to play in a 'shred' style, tried to differentiate their playing in other ways, as Vinnie did. I also bet that Allan Holdsworth was a very strong influence on him, although the sound is very different. So there you have it. It all makes sense.....if you know what you are talking about. The majority of people, don't"
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shramiac
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Re: VV' s musical and technical studies and talk

Postby shramiac » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:13 pm

Excellent post tuko!
Purple guitars kick ass!


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